GMT hand misalignment

Before they came out with black boxes and electronic logs, all of our paper logs had to be written as GMT/military time. 00:05 would be five after.

The time zone for Greenwich, England is the letter “Z” and the military phonetic word is “Zulu”. Since many U.S. military operations must be coordinated across times zones the military uses Greenwich Mean Time (GMT) as the standard time.

Military-Time-Conversion-Chart.png
 
Easy enough to check... at midnight the hour, minute and GMT hands all need to line up exactly at the 12 o'clock position on the dial, no?


would not it be as follows ? ; ... 12 AM MIDNIGHT EASTERN STANDARD TYME the hour hand and minute minute hands both point to 12 ( praying for another good day above ground ).... GMT HAND points to 9 PM on the bezel PACIFIC STANDARD TYME in california ? 3 hours before... or whatever tyme zone your choose EUROZONE 6 HOURS earlier... east gets earlier with each time zone...west gets later with each time zone-

i got no GMT watches so i can not gather empirical data
 
would not it be as follows ? ; ... 12 AM MIDNIGHT EASTERN STANDARD TYME the hour hand and minute minute hands both point to 12 ( praying for another good day above ground ).... GMT HAND points to 9 PM on the bezel PACIFIC STANDARD TYME in california ? 3 hours before... or whatever tyme zone your choose EUROZONE 6 HOURS earlier... east gets earlier with each time zone...west gets later with each time zone-

i got no GMT watches so i can not gather empirical data

The gmt is a 24 hour hand so midnight on east coast would be 2100 hour on that bezel for west coast. So it would be pointing at 52 1/2 minutes if it's aligned properly.

12:00 noon east would be 900 hour on that bezel for west coast.
 
A GMT watch is one of the most useful tool watches for frequent travelers and those who do business across different time zones. Knowing how to use the GMT function allows you to tell time in two places simultaneously. How does this work? Let’s start by looking at the dial.

As you can see, in addition to the hour and minute hands, a GMT watch has a third hand – the GMT hand. On a Rolex Ref. 1675, the GMT hand is red. The GMT hand makes one complete trip around the dial every 24 hours. This hand, in conjunction with the bezel, is what you use to tell time in two different time zones at once.

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With the bezel set straight up at 12 o’clock, the GMT hand is going to read the same time as the hour and minute hands. In this photo, you can see that it’s 4:11 p.m. and that the GMT hand is pointing to the 16 – so it’s 1611 hours, or 4:11 p.m.
To tell time in a different time zone, you will simply rotate the bezel.

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For example, because my manager is in Los Angeles, I always like to be able to quickly tell LA time. Since Los Angeles is three hours behind the east coast, I rotate the bezel three hours back. Local time is 4:11 p.m. and you can see the GMT hand pointing to the 13 – so it’s 1311 hours in Los Angeles or 1:11 p.m.

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To do a quick example in the opposite direction, say I want to know the time in Milan, which is six hours ahead. I’ll just rotate the bezel forward six hours. Again, it’s 4:11 p.m. local time and you can see that the GMT hand is point to the 22 so that means it’s 2211 hours or 10:11 p.m. in Milan. Simple.

 
I checked this and when the GMT lines up at 12 the hour/minute hands read 11:40. When the hour/minute hands line up at 12 the GMT hand is at 12:05


Mike's post is very good in explaining how to set and read a watch that uses GMT... However, I think your question asks is how to verify that the watch hands are properly aligned.

I initially set all hands to the the 12 o'clock AM position and the bezel's 24 also lined up with the 12. After a good winding I let the watch run. In 3 hrs. the hour hand should read 3 o'clock AM and the GMT hand should line up with the 3 on the bezel. After another 3 hours the hour hand should read 6 o'clock AM whereas the GMT hand lines up on the bezel's 6. Another 3 hours goes by and its 9 o'clock AM and the GMT lines up on the bezel's 9. At 12 noon the GMT hand points to 12 on the bezel. Now in 3 hours when the hour hand reads 3PM the GMT should read 15 on the bezel. Another 3 hours and the GMT should point to the 18 (its 6PM). Another 3 hours (its 9PM) and the GMT should line up on the bezel's 21 mark. In another 3 hours all hands go back to the 12 o'clock AM position (bezel's 24 hour mark) If all this happens, your watch works properly.

This is how I check to see if all hands align properly in a 24 hour period with a GMT function. For setting your watch to the different time zones see Mike's post above...
 
Mike's post is very good in explaining how to set and read a watch that uses GMT... However, I think your question asks is how to verify that the watch hands are properly aligned.

I initially set all hands to the the 12 o'clock AM position and the bezel's 24 also lined up with the 12. After a good winding I let the watch run. In 3 hrs. the hour hand should read 3 o'clock AM and the GMT hand should line up with the 3 on the bezel. After another 3 hours the hour hand should read 6 o'clock AM whereas the GMT hand lines up on the bezel's 6. Another 3 hours goes by and its 9 o'clock AM and the GMT lines up on the bezel's 9. At 12 noon the GMT hand points to 12 on the bezel. Now in 3 hours when the hour hand reads 3PM the GMT should read 15 on the bezel. Another 3 hours and the GMT should point to the 18 (its 6PM). Another 3 hours (its 9PM) and the GMT should line up on the bezel's 21 mark. In another 3 hours all hands go back to the 12 o'clock AM position (bezel's 24 hour mark) If all this happens, your watch works properly.

This is how I check to see if all hands align properly in a 24 hour period with a GMT function. For setting your watch to the different time zones see Mike's post above...

Thanks and I an giving that a try.
 
There has been an ongoing GMT issue with Steinhart since 2011. You would think by now it's on their QC radar, but obviously not. I won't be buying any GMT watches from Steinhart. I've seen some people say it's an ETA issue, but all of my GMT ETA watches are fine from various watchmakers, thankfully none are Steinhart.

2011

My new Vintage GMT is actually off by 15mins on the hour (GMT hand). What to do? I really don't want to send it back and have to pay for all the shipping and then wait and then possibly get stuck with paying the duty fee's. Probably easier to get a watch maker to do it here and then perhaps Gunter can pay me back via paypal?

Gunter was very apologetic. He gave me his FedEx account number and will conver all costs to ship back to him and to have it shipped back. Also, if I get charged duty again he will cover it. Watch will be mailed out tomorrow and will arrive by Wednesday. Then Thursday watchmaker will fix the issue and will have it back by Monday. I can't say enough on how bad he felt. Gunter also mentioned that it did miss his QC because of the mad Christmas rush. He does have a team that checks all watches and is surprised this happened. He did mention to his staff that this cannot happen. I am looking very much to having this fixed and too have it back. The other option was to have a local watch maker fix it but I prefer sending it back cause of the warranty. Look I am alittle upset but these things can happen to anyone and I understand.

more and more being GMT hands off... real bad batch. Sucks for Steinhart, they'll be losing a lot of $ having to ship watches back and forth, replacing or fixing them..
I am still going to order a O1 GMT but I gotta admit it is a bit of a turn off. They really should be more careful with quality check before shipping to avoid a bad rep and also save shipping cost. Hope they are addressing with the supplier/manufacturer!

Just to be clear, the mis-alignment issue I had with my previous Ocean GMT was a matter of being 30 minutes off. To me, that was an issue as it renders the GMT function, for all intents and purposes, useless.

I probably wouldn't sweat the situation that ArticMan presented, had that been the case with my GMT.

Nothing against Steinhart, they make great watches and there is no doubt he takes prides in offering great CS when issues arise.. but truly the trick is not having these issues in the first place or consistently working towards minimizing them.

Well, I just received my Ocean 1 gmt today. Surprise, surprise, the gmt hand was out of synch. So, it looks like some of the "new batch' of gmts are not without this same problem. Back to Germany it goes... Gunter must be kicking himself each time he has to ship a misaligned watch back and forth (I know I am)

I too have a new GMT ocean with the same alignment problem. However, mine has an additional twist. If I align the hands for midnight, the GMT is "one minute/mark" ahead. If I manually advance the time a full 24 hours, it will advance with the same offset and eventually return to the same positions at midnight. However, if I let the time advance normally, the GMT hand will advance more quickly will hit the 24hour mark before the "standard" hands reach 10pm. Any thoughts? Is this something a watchmaker can fix?

This must have been a huge batch. My Ocean Vintage GMT does not align either. Seems to be about 6-9 minutes off depending on the hour (which I find strange). I just got the watch yesterday (July 18, 2011) so I'm waiting a bit and wearing it to see if anything improves. Kinda bummed because I had read this thread before buying my GMT and asked Steinhart to check the alignment. Oh well...

2015
I recently noticed the GMT hand on my Steinhart was lagging behind the 12 hour hand and so I sent it to a watchmaker who agreed to have a look and see what the issue was.
He managed to fix the issue but said there was a design fault as there simply wasn't enough room for the 4 hands on the axis of the watch.
It worked OK for a day or so on its return but during my recent holiday the problem occurred again. I again contacted the watchmaker who suggested I should take the issue up with Steinhart.
I have contacted Steinhart this morning and will be interested to see how they respond.

Update on this.
I sent the watch last weeks and got the stock rely of 4-5 weeks wait but then yesterday I got the following reply:
Our watch maker has checked the watch for you and the GMT watch hands is very good adjusted. Please see in attachment I send you the manual for the GMT movement.
The first hour hand has to turn faster cause for 24 h he has to run 2 x 12 (two rounds). The second hour hand runs for every hour in the different time zone just 2,5 minutes and it runs one round in 24 hours.
The watch is on its way back so I'm pleased and surprised it's been sorted out so speedily...whether it works properly is the big question though.

June 2015
So, my first Steinhart was delivered around a week and a half ago, yay! Unfortunately, this watch had some serious QC issues. Think reps are the only watches with issues out of the box? Wrong! Very disappointing for buying a "Swiss Made" watch. All of the issues were things that I could confidently fix on my own, and I did. After receiving it, I only had a day or two before going on vacation and I really wanted to wear it. Yes, I could have sent it back to Germany (from CONUS) and wait god knows how long for a fix or replacement, but decided not to. Anyway, here's my first Steinhart experience saga.

The Steinhart Ocean Vintage GMT is a modern homage to the Rolex 1655, the infamous incorrectly named "Steve McQueen" Explorer II. He is actually thought to never have worn a 1655.

It features a 42mm case, 22mm lugs, domed AR sapphire crystal without cyclops, Swiss ETA 2893-2 21j movement beating at 28,800. Here is a stock pic (not mine)
SteinhartOceanGMTVintage4L.jpg


...and the original
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So, after opening the very nice packaging and looking down at my beautiful new watch, I am immediately struck with the realization that the bezel is out of alignment, and by quite a bit. I haven't even taken the plastic wrapping off yet.
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OK, decision time. At this point, I'm thinking "What the hell?" What "Swiss Made" watch company would let this pass their QC? When there are 24 markers on a bezel, 12 of them being skinny lines, it is very obvious if it is even a little out of alignment. It has to be spot on. There is no acceptable margin of error. It's right or it's wrong, and mine was wrong. QC fail #1. Do I send it back to Steinhart under warranty? No, I decide to fix the bezel myself. It's an easy fix. I have the proper tools and I've done it before.
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OK, well that was an easy fix. Great! All I have to do now is set the time and date, put the bracelet back on, and we should be good, right? Um, no... Here is what I noticed next - QC fail #2: Hour and minute hands out of alignment.
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So now I'm really blown away at how awful the QC at Steinhart is, not a good first impression of the brand. Seriously, how does this get out the door?! I've already started down the rabbit hole with this thing and I really want to wear it on my vacation, so I decide to reset the hands correctly. Before pulling the hands I want to know where the date change occurs, to be able to line everything up perfectly. While doing this, you guessed it, QC fail #3: Date change occurs at 01:54! Really? Are you kidding me? At this point I just threw my hands up and laughed! It is unbelievable that this ever got out the door. ABSOLUTELY NO QUALITY CONTROL WHATSOEVER!!!
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I move onward with fixing this thing. The GMT hand was the only hand correctly installed at Steinhart. It was placed exactly on an hour marker right at the date change, so I didn't have to pull it - just the hour, minute, and seconds hands. This pic is after I set the hour hand in the correct alignment. The minute hand just goes directly over it. It's not difficult and very easy to see if they're out of alignment.
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Got the hands reset the way they should have been from the beginning. Here is 6pm.
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11pm
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And the date change at midnight
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OK, so now it's all fixed and I was able to wear it on my vacation. And guess what? I REALLY love this watch!!! It is a joy to wear. The build quality is excellent. It's just that mine was assembled very poorly. The bracelet is solid. The ETA 2893-2 is just butter smooth and running +3 s/d wearing it all day and leaving it dial up at night. It is just a beautiful watch and it's been on my wrist for about a week now. It has good long lasting lume when charged a long time. On my vacation, went on an all day mountain hike in the sun. No light after sunset and the lume was still very active at 3am looking at it on my night stand.
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Ok, my only thoughts now are whether I let Steinhart know about this. On one hand, they obviously have a problem in their QC and should be informed. On the other, if I let them know that I fixed it on my own, then I'm sure they would say the warranty is void. Who knows?

Final thoughts? Steinhart makes an excellent product at a price point that astonishes me. The polished portion of the clasp looks cool out of the box but is a BAD idea and is really out of place with the rest of the bracelet. It scratches when you breathe on it. This is a fantastic watch and I love it! However, there is something very wrong at Steinhart. Honestly, I don't know if I have the confidence to buy from them again. I was able to fix their mistakes. I expect to have to do that with a Chinese rep, not a bonafide "Swiss Made" watch. In fact, this is the most poorly assembled watch I have ever purchased... Just let that last sentence sink in! Most people would have had to send it back to Germany.

 
Thanks RW. I Sent mine back and that in itself was a nightmare. It seems that in order to use the shipping account that Steinhart offers you have to value the watch at $80 in the shipping invoice. Spent three days trying to address this with Steinhart before I decide to ship it back at my risk. While I like their stuff it's just not worth the effort. At least not for the GMT models.
 
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